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Author of the 2005 book "Spies Among Us," Ira Winkler once said he could train a monkey to hack a computer and the hate mail poured in. An undercover security analyst, he is an expert in corporate espionage and now works with companies to make them more secure. Mr. Winkler worked for the National Security Agency, the most secretive of the U.S. intelligence-gathering agencies. His book exposes the chinks in our national security, as well as in our personal armor via the Internet and mail.

Q: Why do you think you got so much hate mail from that comment?

A: It turns out I took away [the hackers'] significance. Frankly, that's what terrorists come from because everybody wants to be significant in their own way.

Q: Do you buy in to the 9/11 conspiracy theories that claim the government knew?

A: No. I mean, those are people who are delusional. I have some friends who believe George Bush is Satan. Ann Coulter deserves to be burned at a stake today. But everybody generally wants the right thing for the country.

Q: Is it a mistake for people to think they are not worth being spied on?

A: [Laughs.] Oh, everybody is worth being spied on. Just for example, even people who are nearly bankrupt can have their identities stolen and abused. Even dead people's identities are stolen by criminals and foreign spies. Dead or alive, it doesn't matter.

Q: How many spies operate in the United States at any given time?

A: I mean there are tens of thousands of them at any point in time.

Q: How do you define a spy?

A: First off there are domestic competitors, one U.S. company spying on another U.S. company. If, on the other hand, you are talking about professionals from foreign intelligence agencies, they have tens of thousands of people. China has set up 3,000 front companies alone. We found one (which I talk about in my book) which was basically a Chinese restaurant. It was open across the street from the R&D center of a [company in the top five of the Fortune 500 companies].

Q: You say in the book that threats to security exist everywhere.

A: What I try to get at in my book is that people should exercise concern not fear. Security is really about balancing risk.

Q: Any near-death experiences working for the NSA?

A: Not working for them. [Laughs.] Let's just say I've had others working, you know, doing other things. Mostly my own stupidity.

Q: Do identity thieves use paper or the computer more?

A: Lately it's a combination of both. I don't want to give people the false impression that paper thieves are any less important than the other thieves. I actually believe the way people steal information is irrelevant.

Q: Were you concerned that writing the book would give tips to amateur hackers, thieves and spies?

A: The answer is yes and no. The only thing I really remember from the movie "The Color of Money" is when Tom Cruise, who was trained by pool shark Paul Newman, says, "You can't beat me. You taught me everything you know." Paul Newman turns and says, "No, I taught you everything you know -- not everything I know." Honestly, it is kind of a catch-22. It is a balancing act. I am not going to lie.

Q: Are the airports safer now?

A: Oh, no. I mean, everything they did has been purely for show, so far as we can tell. The government is still showing people getting knives and guns through security. And, frankly, while all the attention is being given to the passengers, very little attention is being paid to cargo or the commercial sides of airports.

Q: What about the porous borders?

A: The border situation is really important because the fact of the matter is that people can get back and forth so easily. We had a case where a Russian mobster bought an old Soviet submarine and hired a crew so that he could run drugs into the country. When you have drugs going back and forth, you usually have terrorists going back and forth as well.

Q: So you are saying there is no real way to control the situation?

A: There is, but it requires significantly more effort. Sending the National Guard to the border is barely going to stop anything.

Q: So, are these big agencies -- the CIA, NSA and the FBI -- effective?

A: Yes, they're effective. But it depends in what regard. Are they 100 percent effective? The answer is, clearly, no. Is the NSA domestic spying program effective? Clearly, no. It's a lot of smoke and mirrors for very little payback. The NSA is generally effective at gathering intelligence on people we are targeting. The same thing with the CIA and FBI.

Q: Where do you stand on the Patriot Act?

A: As it is I would be against it. Because let's look at airline security. Airline security after Sept. 11 was a knee-jerk reaction. The reality is, if I'm hijacked by somebody with a pair of tweezers, I deserve to die.

Q: Would you say politics gets in the way of security?

A: Politics is one of the greatest enemies of security. If people looked at security from a rational perspective we would get a lot better security than we have now.