In the Poconos, one developer is proposing a water park, shopping center and train station to accompany a slots casino. Another has plans for a spa, a 200-room luxury hotel, restaurants and housing. A third is pitching a convention area, restaurants, shops and a spa.

In Bethlehem, the Las Vegas Sands Corp. is touting plans to transform the old Bethlehem Steel site into an $879 million development which would include a casino, a hotel, an upscale mall and apartments. A performing arts complex also is in the works on land donated by the developer.

Planet Hollywood wants to put a $380 million casino along the Delaware River in Philadelphia which would include a TV studio, Hollywood memorabilia and celebrity marketing.

While developers elsewhere in the state seem to be trying to top one another in crafting grandiose plans to get an edge in bids for lucrative state casino licenses, that has not been the case in Pittsburgh, where most of the talk has centered on a new arena, with little in the way of specifics from other possible bidders.

In fact, if anything, an industry expert who serves as a consultant for the Pittsburgh Gaming Task Force, which is studying the impact of slots, has sought to downplay expectations.

Jennifer Lendler has said the state's 54 percent tax rate on slots revenue and $50 million entry fee could be impediments to a Las Vegas-style "destination" casino.

That's despite the fact that the license for the Pittsburgh casino, with up to 5,000 slot machines, could be the most valuable of the 14 to be issued in the state. There will be one here, not two, as in Philadelphia. And the casino won't be competing with Atlantic City, N.J., as will those to the east.

Mayor Tom Murphy has expressed frustration about the lack of public discussion involving the impact of gambling, including what Pittsburghers want in terms of community benefit from the operator.

Still, task force members and others, including some of the potential bidders themselves, caution against making too much of the apparent lack of grand designs at this point. They say it's too early because no one has unveiled a formal proposal.

They said they didn't expect Pittsburgh to be shortchanged, though issues such as land and amenities already available to visitors Downtown could end up affecting the scope of the proposals.

"It may not have all the bells and whistles of a casino hotel you would find in Las Vegas or Atlantic City, but, nevertheless, it should be a nice property," said Joe Weinert, vice president of Spectrum Gaming Group, an industry consultant.

John Brabender, a spokesman for MTR Gaming, which is proposing to build a casino near the 16th Street Bridge on the North Shore, said bidders in areas such as the Poconos might feel the need to add amenities such as water parks and malls to attract visitors.

"They're trying to take an area that's not a multifaceted destination site and make it into one. The city already is a multifaceted destination site. The question is how to make it a better one," he said.

Nonetheless, there are factors that could work against developers here. One of the biggest is land. It is harder to come by in Pittsburgh than in the Poconos, or even Bethlehem, with hundreds of acres available at the Bethlehem Steel site alone.

"Clearly, when you're talking about development in rural areas with expansive tracts of land, that differs substantially from all of the locations we know of right now [in Pittsburgh]," said Ron Porter, co-chair of the Pittsburgh Gaming Task Force. "There are space prohibitions that have to be factored into any projected building."

Mr. Weinert said developers were wrestling with the same issue in Philadelphia and Las Vegas.

"Land in urban areas is at a premium. A developer's best wishes oftentimes are on a collision course with reality," he said.

In Mr. Weinert's mind, the proposed Pittsburgh casino probably would be accompanied by entertainment, restaurants and some nightspots. "I would expect some sort of attraction uniquely Pittsburgh, something iconic," he said.

Mr. Porter and Anne Swager, the other task force co-chair, said the proposals from potential operators might end up being far more elaborate than anyone has envisioned, particularly given the level of competition for the Pittsburgh license.

The only potential operator that has been specific about its plans is the Penguins. The team is promising to privately fund a replacement for the Mellon Arena with slots revenues and keep professional hockey in Pittsburgh.

Penguins consultant David Morehouse said the proposal would be likely to extend beyond that to include a component "to open up 28 acres of the current arena site for a major redevelopment," with nearly 42 acres in all involved.

In a bid for a new arena several years ago, the Penguins proposed an overall development it estimated at some $700 million. It included an arena, rental and for-sale housing, three to seven office buildings, retail and restaurant space, a 264-room hotel and several parking garages.

It is expected that many of those same elements, plus a casino, will be part of the Penguins' proposal for the slots license.

Merrill Stabile, president of Alco Parking Corp., wants to build a casino on the North Shore near PNC Park. He would not detail his plans, but said his proposal would involve more than a casino. "The fact of the matter is that it's our belief that whatever this project should be, it shouldn't be just gambling," he said.

He has promised to donate a portion of slots revenues each year to selected community assets.

MTR Gaming, owner of Mountaineer Race Track and Gaming Resort, has pledged to donate $6 million a year in slots revenue toward the building of a new arena. It also is looking at entertainment, restaurants and other amenities which could enhance tourism and add to the city's vibrancy, Mr. Brabender said.

Station Square owner Forest City Enterprises has yet to discuss its plans. It is working with Harrah's Entertainment and has enough land to add more amenities to what is now a popular entertainment spot.

Another expected bidder, Beaver County developer Charles Betters, is proposing a casino as part of a $500 million development in Hays which would include a thoroughbred racetrack, a hotel, apartments and houses.